BEMA Episode Link: 239: Abraham Considers a Catechism w/ Reed Dent
Episode Length: 56:05
Published Date: Thu, 30 Sep 2021 01:00:00 -0700
Session 6
About this episode:

Brent Billings is joined by Reed Dent to discuss the meaning of faith and the fears associated with deconstruction, both within a person and for those around them.

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Transcript for BEMA 239

Notes

*Note: The following notes are handwritten by me, Adam, and I reserve the right to be wrong.

BEMA 239: Abraham Considers a Catechism w/ Reed Dent - Study Notes

Title & Source Summary

Episode: 239 - Abraham Considers a Catechism w/ Reed Dent Hosts: Brent Billings and Reed Dent (Marty Solomon absent) Focus: Deconstruction, reconstruction, faith as trust versus intellectual assent, and navigating theological questions in community

This episode continues the conversation from Episode 231 about deconstruction and reconstruction of faith. Reed Dent and Brent Billings discuss what it means to hold faith less rigidly, the difference between faith as intellectual agreement versus lived trust in God, and practical guidance for navigating theological wrestling within families and communities. The conversation emphasizes that faith is fundamentally about trust expressed through action, using Abraham as the model, rather than simply agreeing with detailed doctrinal statements.

Key Takeaways

• Faith is primarily about trust in God expressed through action, not simply intellectual agreement with doctrinal statements or catechisms
• Abraham’s faith was demonstrated by walking in obedience to God’s call, not by having complete theological understanding
• Deconstruction should aim at removing obstructions that make faith unlivable, not simply making things less complicated for convenience
• The underlying assumption that “faith equals agreeing with ideas about God” must be challenged, or we risk replacing one set of ideas with another without actually growing in trust
• Anger in response to theological questions is often a defensive emotion protecting something vulnerable, requiring compassion rather than defensiveness
• Parents should teach children that faith is a process rather than a possession to be kept static and protected from challenging questions
• The journey of faith often moves from innocence to experience and back to a differently-colored innocence characterized by assurance rather than certainty
• Language matters profoundly - we must dig deeper into what people actually mean by terms rather than assuming shared understanding based on shared vocabulary

Main Concepts & Theories

Faith as Trust vs. Intellectual Assent

Reed distinguishes between faith as a set of beliefs we agree with versus faith as active trust in God. He questions whether Abraham would recognize modern statements of belief or catechisms as “faith” in the biblical sense. The Scripture says “Abraham believed God” - not “believed in God” or “believed X about God.” Abraham received a promise, believed God, and then upheaved his whole life in response. The upheaving itself - the walking - was his faith.

This distinction is crucial because when faith becomes primarily about intellectual agreement with propositions, it can become a form of idolatry regardless of whether one is conservative or progressive in their theology. Faith as a “thought experiment” disconnected from lived trust and action misses the biblical emphasis.

Deconstruction as Removing Obstructions

Deconstruction is described as pulling apart various aspects of what we believe about God and examining them independently before seeing how they fit back together. The pruning metaphor suggests cutting away parts of faith that have become unworkable or unlivable so more fruit can grow in healthy parts.

However, Reed warns that deconstruction aimed merely at simplicity for its own sake misses the point. The goal should be dealing with obstructions that make faith unlivable or push us in directions contrary to what the Spirit is saying. If deconstruction only replaces one set of ideas with another without leading to greater lived trust in God and orientation of our actual lives around God’s calling, then we’ve just become smarter without acquiring actual faith.

Worldviews as Scaffolding

Reed reiterates the scaffolding metaphor from Episode 231: worldviews, doctrines, creeds, dogma, hermeneutics, and opinions are all scaffolding around the building of faith itself. Scaffolding is necessary and not inherently bad, but it’s not the thing itself. Whether conservative or progressive, Western or Eastern, all theological frameworks remain scaffolding.

The danger is that deconstruction can examine and replace scaffolding while never touching the underlying assumption that faith is fundamentally about ideas we agree with. This keeps us trapped in scaffolding-thinking even if we’ve changed which scaffolding we prefer.

The Arc from Innocence to Experience to Renewed Innocence

Reed describes a three-stage arc of faith development that everyone goes through:

1. Innocence - We start naive and sentimental with certainty about faith. We know how things work and nothing has challenged that yet. The ugly side can be anti-intellectualism that refuses to engage complexity.

2. Experience - Something comes along that disrupts what we thought we knew. This leads to questioning and doubting. The ugly side can calcify into cynicism. This is a normal and necessary stage.

3. Renewed Innocence - We return to innocence on the far side of experience, but with different color and tenor. Certainty gives way to assurance. Doubts become reverence for mystery. Cynicism becomes conviction and honesty. We hold what we believe honestly, not knowing every answer but having wrestled with questions.

This arc is biblical, reflected in the relationship between Proverbs and Ecclesiastes. Proverbs presents wisdom as “do this and that will happen” - the righteous prosper and live long. Ecclesiastes deconstructs this with “the race doesn’t always go to the swift” and “who can make straight what God has made crooked?” Wisdom is holding both perspectives together.

Faith as Process Not Possession

Quoting Freddie Buechner, Reed emphasizes thinking of faith more as a verb than a noun, more as a process than a possession. Many Christians treat faith as something acquired at a point and then protected from anything that might damage it - kept static on a shelf, dusted off occasionally.

This possessive view of faith creates fear about sending children to secular colleges or encountering challenging ideas. Instead, faith should be understood as an ongoing process of responding in faithfulness to God, letting faith “work itself out in love” as Paul says in Galatians 5:6.

Language, Power, and the Gospel Without Native Language

Reed connects the Tower of Babel story to how structures of power consolidate through accepted sets of language and terminology. When everyone must use the same approved vocabulary, it creates conformity and uniformity that isn’t healthy.

The counterpoint is Acts where the Gospel is proclaimed and everyone hears in their own language - the Gospel has no native language and should be diverse in its expression. This means we must dig deeper into what people actually mean by terms rather than assuming agreement or disagreement based on surface-level vocabulary.

The principle: “Don’t ever say ‘I disagree’ until you can say ‘I understand’” and don’t assume you understand just because someone used a certain word. Ask “tell me what you mean by that” in a spirit of charity.

Examples & Applications

Abraham’s Faith Journey

Abraham serves as the primary example throughout the discussion. He didn’t have a catechism, didn’t need to articulate fine points of doctrine, and certainly didn’t understand everything about where God was leading. His faith was demonstrated by literally walking away from his father’s house and gods toward a land God would show him. Each step of that journey was an act of faith - not the theological conclusions he reached along the way.

This means Abraham’s faith included mistakes and misunderstandings. He didn’t “get it all the way” when he started. But he trusted God enough to walk the path even when things went wrong. This model of faith emphasizes trust and forward movement over complete understanding.

The Brother’s Question About Creation

Reed shares a personal story of his brother nervously asking late one night: “Do you think you can believe that the world wasn’t created in seven literal 24-hour days and still be a Christian?” The hesitation in his voice revealed his fear of being scolded for even asking the question. When Reed affirmed that of course you can, his brother experienced profound relief.

This illustrates how communities can create fear around honest questions by establishing boundaries of acceptable inquiry. People internalize these boundaries and become afraid to voice doubts even to family members, not knowing if it’s “okay to even ask.”

Jon Steingard and Incentives Against Wrestling

Brent references an episode of “You Have Permission” featuring Jon Steingard, former lead singer of Christian band Hawk Nelson. Steingard wrestled with doubts and questions early in his career but had powerful incentives not to engage those questions - financial security, band membership, public identity, and reputation were all at stake.

This example highlights how people may have legitimate reasons for not engaging theological wrestling beyond simple stubbornness or lack of interest. Family relationships, employment, community standing, and financial stability can all create pressure to avoid honest questions.

College Students Who “Knew Every Answer”

Reed, as a campus minister, describes meeting college students who had memorized every verse, attended all the VBSs, and were the most influential kids in their youth groups. By some standards, their parents “did their job raising them right.” But many of these students held their faith with such a particular posture that when cognitive dissonance set in - when they encountered questions and difficulties they’d never faced - their faith crumbled because they didn’t know how to handle uncertainty.

This demonstrates the inadequacy of treating faith primarily as knowing the right answers. Without the capacity to wrestle with questions and doubts, even comprehensive biblical knowledge doesn’t sustain faith through challenges.

God as Mother vs. Father

Reed discusses how people can get hung up on language like referring to God with feminine metaphors or pronouns. Some react strongly: “God’s not female, we can’t talk about God that way.” But Reed points out that God doesn’t have male physiology either - God is neither male nor female.

When someone refers to God as mother or uses “she” pronouns, rather than immediately drawing battle lines, we should ask “tell me what you mean by that.” Often the person is emphasizing God’s nurturing, sustaining qualities - perfectly orthodox theology just expressed in unfamiliar vocabulary. This example shows how lack of charitable interpretation of language creates unnecessary division.

Proverbs and Ecclesiastes Together

The relationship between Proverbs and Ecclesiastes models how Scripture itself includes deconstructive voices. Proverbs presents straightforward wisdom: “Set your heart on the Lord and he will make your paths straight.” Ecclesiastes responds: “Who can make straight what God has made crooked? The race doesn’t always go to the swift.”

Both books are canonical Scripture. Parents should teach children both perspectives - the structure and logic of the world AND the reality that life doesn’t always work out as expected. This prepares children to navigate the inevitable “Ecclesiastical crisis” when their Proverbs-based expectations encounter reality.

Potential Areas for Further Exploration

1. Historical development of catechisms and statements of belief - How did early Christians articulate faith before formalized creeds? What role did creeds play in different historical contexts? When did statements of belief shift from communal identity markers to gatekeeping mechanisms?

2. Neuroscience and theology of certainty vs. assurance - What does research on how the brain handles ambiguity and uncertainty reveal about different stages of faith development? How might neurological responses to cognitive dissonance inform pastoral approaches to deconstruction?

3. Cross-cultural expressions of biblical faith - How do non-Western cultures articulate Christian faith differently than Western systematic theology? What can we learn from how faith is expressed in oral cultures versus literate cultures?

4. The role of doubt in biblical narratives - Deeper study of how biblical characters (Abraham, Moses, David, Job, disciples, etc.) wrestled with doubt and uncertainty. What does the inclusion of these stories in Scripture suggest about God’s view of questioning?

5. Galatians 5:6 and the primacy of love - More thorough exegesis of “faith expressing itself through love” in its full context. How does Paul’s argument about circumcision and law observance inform contemporary debates about doctrinal precision?

6. Trauma and theological deconstruction - How does personal and collective trauma impact theological frameworks? What pastoral approaches best support people whose faith frameworks have been shattered by traumatic experiences?

7. The sociology of religious language - Deeper study of how in-group terminology functions to create and maintain community boundaries. How can communities maintain cohesion while remaining open to linguistic diversity?

8. Faith formation in children and adolescents - What does developmental psychology suggest about age-appropriate ways to introduce complexity and uncertainty? How can parents cultivate resilience alongside biblical literacy?

9. The relationship between action and belief - Philosophical and theological exploration of how behavior shapes belief versus how belief shapes behavior. What does “orthopraxy” (right practice) versus “orthodoxy” (right belief) look like in practice?

10. Biblical metaphors for God beyond anthropomorphism - Comprehensive study of non-human metaphors Scripture uses for God (rock, fire, wind, mother hen, etc.). What do these reveal about God that anthropomorphic language doesn’t capture?

Comprehension Questions

1. According to Reed, what is the fundamental difference between “Abraham believed God” and “Abraham believed in God” or “believed X about God”? Why does this distinction matter for how we understand faith?

2. Reed warns that deconstruction can examine and replace theological ideas while never touching an underlying assumption. What is that assumption, and why is it problematic even for progressive or deconstructed faith?

3. Describe the three-stage arc Reed outlines from innocence through experience to renewed innocence. How does this arc relate to the relationship between the books of Proverbs and Ecclesiastes?

4. What does Reed mean when he says “faith is more a verb than a noun, more a process than a possession”? How does this perspective change the way parents might approach raising children in faith?

5. Reed discusses how anger in response to theological questions is often a “defensive emotion.” What does he suggest this defensiveness is protecting, and how should we respond to anger with compassion rather than counter-defensiveness?

Summary

Episode 239 continues the conversation about deconstruction and reconstruction by focusing on the fundamental nature of faith itself. Reed Dent and Brent Billings argue that Christianity has often confused faith with intellectual agreement to doctrinal propositions, when biblical faith is primarily about trust in God expressed through obedient action. Using Abraham as the paradigmatic example, they emphasize that Abraham’s faith was his walking in response to God’s call, not his theological understanding or certainty.

The hosts caution that deconstruction should aim at removing obstructions to lived faith rather than simply making theology less complicated for convenience. The real danger is replacing one set of ideas with another without ever challenging the underlying assumption that faith equals agreeing with ideas about God. True reconstruction must lead to greater lived trust and action, not just different (or simpler) theology.

They provide pastoral guidance for navigating theological wrestling in relationships and communities, emphasizing compassion toward those who respond with anger or disinterest, recognizing the real incentives people face against engaging hard questions, and the importance of digging deeper into language rather than assuming shared meaning based on shared vocabulary. For parents, they stress teaching faith as an ongoing process that will include stages of questioning and doubt rather than as a possession to be protected from challenging ideas.

The conversation consistently points back to Galatians 5:6 - “The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love” - as the kernel to which all theological exploration should return. This isn’t anti-intellectual simplicity but rather wisdom earned on the far side of experience, where certainty gives way to assurance and cynicism gives way to conviction held honestly without needing to know every answer.

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